TRAD WIFE OR TRAPPED WIFE? SPLITTING THE BILLS IN 2026

Welcome To Judgment Call

SPEAKER_04 0:00

She's seen it all from the bench. He's helped couples through it all. Now they're making the call on the internet's biggest relationship debates. Real relationships, real reactions, real talk. This is Judgment Call.

SPEAKER_03 0:19

Well, hello, everybody, and welcome back to the next episode of Judgment Call. I am your friendly neighborhood psychiatrist, Dr. Is, and we've got the always amazing, Judge Lynn Tolan. Lynn, how you doing today? I'm doing all right, Dr. Ish. How you doing? Um, I'm doing good. I'm doing well. Um, been hearing a lot, a lot of buzzy, buzzy things about uh who's doing what out there in terms of relationships and who's entitled to ask for what and why. So I'm hoping uh that Madison's got some really cool stuff queued up for us to kind of get us into that conversation today.

SPEAKER_11 0:52

Let me ask. Madison, you got it got anything for us on the relationship side.

SPEAKER_09 0:59

Judgment

The 50-50 Debate And Mismatch

SPEAKER_09 1:00

call.

SPEAKER_05 1:01

Would you be okay with us going 50-50? Of course, no problem. Okay, so we can split the bills, we can split the 50-50 and everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:09

50-50, uh, you give me 50% your property, 50% your salary, 50% all you own, no problem. And the bill, no problem. I pay 100%.

SPEAKER_05 1:21

That's that's not the way that it works because um I 50-50 what you told me. Yeah, but I meant like for the rent, like you know, I went I meant for broker.

SPEAKER_07 1:29

What rent? You need to buy me an apartment.

SPEAKER_05 1:32

I well, yeah, we could discuss about that, but then what what about what I'm bringing to the table?

SPEAKER_07 1:37

What do you bring to the table?

SPEAKER_05 1:39

I I will protect you.

SPEAKER_07 1:41

Um I I don't need protection, I'm a Russian.

SPEAKER_05 1:44

Um, I I can I can provide for you.

SPEAKER_07 1:48

Provide okay, 50% all you have, it's mine.

SPEAKER_05 1:51

I meant more so like um I can make you laugh.

SPEAKER_07 1:54

So yeah, you do with things you say 50-50, you make me laugh.

SPEAKER_11 2:01

The 50-50 argument ish, it is a big one today. Have you been paying attention?

SPEAKER_03 2:08

Oh my god. Jeff, I I'm I'm I'm laughing over here because she's over here playing chess and he's not even playing check because he's playing marbles because she's doing laughs around him. I love the guys who try to talk about what they're bringing to the table in one breath, but then in the very next breath, they turn around and ask her to pay half the bill.

SPEAKER_11 2:33

Yeah, and and and the conversation has gotten so ridiculous. It's gotten, should we do 50-50? Is it a hundred and zero? And it to me, you can't ask that question because it depends on the two people in it. What worked for me and Eric wouldn't work for you and your wife, it wouldn't everything is different. Somebody's some people are good with money, some people aren't. Everybody has a different emotional relationship to money. I like to I like my money as bubble wrap. That's right, that's right. My husband wanted to fund the money. Let's go have a good time with it, let's run over here. So every time I took a dollar of uh for safety, I was killing his fun. And every time he took a dollar for fun, he was killing my safety. So we had to work that out. So it's not a matter of what are the rules? Is it 50-50? It's what works for us.

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

If you don't mind me asking, how did y'all because money is a very it's a deeply personal thing for most of us? How did y'all work that out? Who who who was the emotional leader to have that conversation?

SPEAKER_11 3:40

It was me, and it was me because I'm the one that had to do the most adjusting. I was raised in a household. My husband, my husband had his own business. So some months were good, some months were bad. So, you know, and I was my my my salary was consistent. Boom, boom, boom, boom, every week. And so when he came with inconsistent money, yeah, I had inconsistent feelings about that.

SPEAKER_03 4:06

You got it, yeah.

SPEAKER_11 4:07

And then I had to, but I had to learn. You know what I mean? So I took care, and it was easier for me to take care of the bills, and he would just contribute as he could, and I just never looked at what he contributed. I just, yeah, you know, we paid all, we paid it all into one account, and I would just pay the bills out. And so it wasn't a matter of who was paying what, is he paid as much as he could, I did the rest.

SPEAKER_03 4:31

The bigger conversation is relationship equity and and marital equity, right? Who's doing the who's doing what emotional labor and what is that worth to the marriage? Like you said, it's gonna be different for every for every couple, and that that equity isn't always measured in dollars. Sometimes it's measured in emotional labor, sometimes it's measured in caregiving, sometimes it's measured in planning, sometimes it's measured in who's doing the business of running the marriage, right? There's so many different markers you get to use.

SPEAKER_11 5:01

And I think and I love that you said that because the money piece does get a huge amount of press, but the emotional piece is is equally important, if not more important.

SPEAKER_03 5:15

Exactly, exactly. And now here he's got an issue, right? He's talking to a Russian woman. Now, if you know anything about Russian culture and Russian single women in general, one thing that they do not play about, I mean, no games whatsoever is about their money. Okay. I did not know that. That is a problem that they are having that conversation with you before they give you their number or their Instagram or anything else because we're going to get that part right first. Because if it's not right for me, there's no use in me wasting your time. He's got to know his personnel. Um, and it's not a gold digger situation at all. And I don't even like that term. The funny thing about it, most of the folks who, most of the guys who I hear talking about gold diggers are the very guys who ain't got no gold. So, Chuck, you know, it's interesting, so because there's so many different markers that you can use in terms of equal division of emotional labor in the relationship. We, you know, when we think about who's bringing what to the table, we naturally think, okay, providing protective money, yes, but there's a laundry list of other things that over the years are gonna trump money by a long shot.

SPEAKER_11 6:29

And it has to do with who you are. My husband had to fill in the holes of my fears. You know, everybody looked at me on TV, oh, she's she's she's lively, she's this and that. But I was I was a fearful person. And part of his job of providing and protecting wasn't had nothing to do with with this, it had to do with this, you know, to to make sure I was okay when I would make those maddening calls from marriage boot camp. I can't take it no more, baby. I can't take it. He knew what to do, yeah. And and and that's you know, money is easier to make than than finding someone who can find your week and not only doesn't hurt you there, but protects it.

SPEAKER_03 7:11

They can work with it, they can work with it. Anybody who anybody who I'm with, I am a true cancer. I love nothing more than to go back into my shell and I don't need to come out for a week or two. Right? And so for me, that isolation works, it's safety, it's certainty. I love, I love being doing the homebody thing. But it's so anybody with me, I appreciate beyond words and more than any dollar value I could ever spend of them helping coax me out of that shell. Hey, there's some there's some cool life to live out here. You might want to try some of this. Let's just see.

SPEAKER_11 7:46

Absolutely. So instead of spending our time at the table like they were talking about what 50% really means, and I want 50% of everything you got. I don't know if she was serious or not, but uh talk about what it is you really need. You know, we all need money, you gotta live.

SPEAKER_03 8:02

Right, right. What are those means you want that are gonna sustain you over time? I love how playful she was with him, though. She didn't she didn't get offended by the statement, she just was curious and she was playful in listening to his explanation.

SPEAKER_11 8:17

And he didn't have she didn't care at all what he was saying. She really did she was on her game and everything. So, judgment call. Let's see, the judgment call is I don't know what to say. They're they're on a different page, they're on a different, they're on a different wavelength.

SPEAKER_03 8:37

I think the judgment call is for clarity, as we say here in Miami, claro, because they both got some clarity. See, he now knows, she now knows he's not the guy for her, and he now knows not the woman for me.

SPEAKER_10 8:53

For me for me.

SPEAKER_11 8:54

So exactly the call is they did all right.

SPEAKER_03 8:57

They did all right.

SPEAKER_11 8:58

They found the information. Just because they didn't find their soulmate, didn't mean they didn't do a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 9:03

Absolutely, you got it.

SPEAKER_11 9:05

Sometimes it's important to know who not to be with.

SPEAKER_09 9:08

Oh, even more.

SPEAKER_11 9:10

Madison, what do you got on for us next?

Men Are The Prize Claim

SPEAKER_09 9:14

Judgment call.

SPEAKER_00 9:16

Men are the prize in the relationship. The type of man most women want, a man who can provide, who can protect them, who is handsome, who can lay it down in bed, six foot five, whatever the hell else that song said, is a rarity. That's not something you can find every day. Women, men just want a woman who is good looking and can provide peace. Men are rare like diamonds. Women are the same on every other street corner, just like McDonald's. Now, don't get me wrong, I love McDonald's. I will fight for my life for McDonald's, but that doesn't make McDonald's the prize. That doesn't make McDonald's gourmet. The men are the prize.

SPEAKER_03 9:56

Listen, I am going to take a step back, Your Honor, and I'm going to let's do uh let's see.

SPEAKER_11 10:05

Well, I think you're gonna leave me out. Men are the prize. Marriage is the prize for a lot of women. Um not so much these days as it was back when I was traveling young. But marriage was the prize. Um but to say that women are fungible commodities that we're we're all like one another, like like we're in McDonald's on every corner. I can send a woman in there that would tear your piece to shreds. I can send a woman in your house that will, you know, make you go crazy or do women are people. And it's not we're we're we're not just genitalia with right. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 10:51

Right, right. Yeah, I think um, you know, it's a dis I don't like it. It's a disgusting comment. Women are like McDonald's. I mean, that's just right. We that's this, it's ridiculous, it's childish, it's sophomored, it's all the things, all those things. But he is verbalizing, he is giving voice to a sentiment of a lot of young guys right now, right? And a lot of what we've got going on here in this country is a lot of young guys who are alone, angry, sexless, and they have no idea why their woman would want them anymore, right? Because women are out educating them, out-earning them, and women have clearly stated there's a lot of things we can do on our own, and we don't need you to do that anymore. And so these guys, when I hear him shouting and guys like him shouting about why they're the prize, I hear the question behind the shout, which is, I'm not really sure why you would want me anymore.

SPEAKER_11 11:52

And another take on that is from the woman's side, which is we do start talking a lot of that yin-yang about he's got to be over $100,000 a year. He's got to be a you know, high value man. I think Kevin Samuel is part of that. It's never gonna go away. And he's got to be over six feet, and if you and if you settle for anybody less than that, then you are in fact settling. And I just think the whole idea of it is destroying love. You know what I mean? The whole idea of all of these resume items that someone may or may not have when you meet them. Like when my parents met, my father didn't have anything. He was a lawyer, but he didn't have anything because he was just divorced. Now, if she would have required him to be six foot and and have over a hundred thousand dollars, she wouldn't marry him. He was five foot two and had nothing, but he ended up with a lot. So it's it's too much of um we become just stuck on the physical and not the emotional. Do you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_03 13:01

I know exactly what you're saying. I think people are so afraid of being hurt, let down, disappointed, and it not being the one that we've trying to come up with an algorithm that's gonna make sure that none of that happens, but the things that we're plugging into the algo aren't the things that are gonna lead you to a fulfilling life with your partner. Exactly.

SPEAKER_11 13:22

Yeah exactly. So on this one, um, my judgment call is he couldn't be no more wrong if he worked at it.

SPEAKER_03 13:34

Yeah, that's just come on, man. He's got he's gotta do better. He's gotta do better. But but again, he's given voice to a large sentiment. There's a lot of really young, angry, alone, unlovable, sexless guys out there who really don't know why it is their woman would want them. And when they can't ask that question, when they can't answer that question, they fill it up with the anger that we saw here.

SPEAKER_11 13:57

And we need to hear that voice too, and we need to understand it. We need to do something about it. And I mean, the on both sides of the scale, we have become so um, you know, structured. The algorithm is teaching us how to not like each other.

SPEAKER_03 14:11

Exactly.

SPEAKER_11 14:12

And how to go for that one percent of people that has these particular abilities and not the other 99% on both sides. It's it's on both sides. On both sides.

SPEAKER_03 14:24

Yep. Yep.

SPEAKER_11 14:24

So I'm gonna read another I am the asshole. I

Rent Splits When One Earns More

SPEAKER_11 14:27

know you love these people.

SPEAKER_03 14:28

My favorites.

SPEAKER_11 14:29

Am I the asshole for not wanting to go 50-50 on rent when my boyfriend makes more money than me? My boyfriend and I split the rent. The income he makes isn't double of what I make, but pretty close to it. We both agreed to split things down the middle, and he said since he had extra money that I could ask him for what I want from him, and since I'm left with like 400 after paying rent, I thought, okay, that could work. But it hasn't been because when I ask for things, he says no, if he thinks he shouldn't have it or if we should save. I just feel like he isn't keeping his part of the deal. And so I keep bringing it up because I'm starting to resent it. He's always saying things like, I have other stuff to do with my money too. You need to save, then you would have more. I think we should make some sort of a arrangement that is fair. Am I the asshole for thinking that? I would say no.

SPEAKER_02 15:24

This is clearly not the asshole.

SPEAKER_11 15:26

No. He is making more than twice than you are, but you're paying half the rent. You're splitting 50-50, and you're not economically able to do that and still have enough money to live. And had he gone in with your uh original, had he stuck to his original plan, if you need a little extra, because I know you don't have much, I'll give it to you. But if he's not gonna give it to her, she has a right to be upset.

SPEAKER_03 15:52

Right. Well, well, now, right, he's changing the terms of the negotiation. Exactly. Right. And that's he's moving the goalposts. That is absolutely not fair. You said you were gonna do this and provide that, and now you're using it as a bargaining chip to judge me and my behavior and and how I take care of my own money. If you he's making a hundred and you're making 50, you can't pay the same amount of rent. That just doesn't make sense. Why are you there? I mean, I mean, my lord, what is he actually providing then?

SPEAKER_11 16:21

Right, exactly. And he's getting a tremendous bang for his buck, you know, because he's paying 50% of the rent. Right. So I don't think she's the asshole.

SPEAKER_03 16:32

No, she's not the asshole at all. I'm gonna, as a man, I'm gonna say, bro, you're being an asshole about this. You're being a straight up jerk. Come on.

SPEAKER_11 16:42

I think just say he needs to adjust his behavior.

SPEAKER_03 16:44

If he needs to adjust his, he's got to adjust his just not fair. She's talking about having 400 bucks left at after she pays rent and having to ask him like you would ask your parent right for an allowance for things I can do. How does how do I feel good about showing up in that relationship? Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_11 17:03

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 17:06

I can't feel I can't feel good about that.

SPEAKER_11 17:08

Yeah. I'm with you, Ish. No.

SPEAKER_03 17:12

That kind of listen, as somebody with five sisters who've seen that setup before, that just kind of pisses me off. I don't like that.

SPEAKER_11 17:18

Yeah. And I like that it pisses you off. I really do. Madison, what do you got up next for us?

SPEAKER_09 17:27

Judgment call.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

The man

When Dating Turns Transactional

SPEAKER_01 17:30

who isn't thrilled to spend money on you or to do something that makes your life easier or do something that makes you happy just doesn't like you that much. I'm not saying this to be harsh, but hear me out. There are so many women out there that feel guilty when a man shows up for them, a man wants to invest in them. Whether that's paying for dinner or helping out with something or doing a little thing that makes your life easier. We have been conditioned to believe that allowing that help makes us feel like a burden. Or we feel like we owe them something. When a man genuinely likes you, he wants to give to you. It's in his nature to provide and to compress your life better. So why would you want to take that feeling away from us? Accepting his help doesn't make you a bullet. And letting someone show up for you. That is the full essence of being in your divine feminine. You don't owe him anything for that. Also don't have to shrink yourself into being low maintenance because the right guy finds joy in giving, especially to the woman that he values. Definitely doesn't keep score or make you feel bad about it. So let this be your sign to let go of the guilt. You're not asking for too much, you're just asking the wrong one.

SPEAKER_11 18:35

You know what I find interesting about this ish? What's that? Is just in terms of money. Uh-huh. Did you notice that? Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_03 18:44

Very transactional, right?

SPEAKER_11 18:46

Very about the transactional. Let a guy help you out. Let him guy do the things my husband did for me that were of greatest value had nothing to do with money. He was my campaign manager for my judicial campaign. I mean, it was in the doing and the saying and the feeling. And to reduce it to dollars just demeans the whole thing.

SPEAKER_03 19:10

Well, it does. It diminishes the whole thing. Um it's a super transactional world in terms of dating now. Uh, it's about what I'm what I'm bringing and what I'm giving and what I'm getting in return. Um, and so there are new rules in terms of that. You know what I mean? And one of those hard and fast rules is guys, if she likes you, she'll do it for free. You won't have to pay. And ladies, if he really likes you, he won't mind paying for whatever it is. You know what I mean? And so that's because at the end of the day, we're all allowed those moments of humanity and all those things. So I hear what you're saying about her talking and keeping it about the money, but the deeper thing, and she said, if he wants to pay or do those things that help make your life easier. So I'm gonna give her a wide birth. And there you go. That's true. She did say that that maybe she's also including some of those smaller things, right? Everybody, everybody, not everybody, but okay, you're gonna get on Instagram and you're gonna post. Nobody posts about the guy who reminds you to call your mom on a birthday. Nobody posts about the guy who walked your dog because you were late from work. Nobody posts about that. Everybody posts about the guy who flew you out, took you out, and laid you down. Well, one of those things is gonna sustain a relationship, and the other one thing is just not.

SPEAKER_11 20:30

Yeah, and we and and and we're valuing the wrong thing. And it's because we've got those shows where people are popping balloons and everything is so superficial. And a couple of questions can I make a love hookup? And it's and it's exactly the wrong thing.

SPEAKER_03 20:46

Yeah, yeah. You know what, Judge, what do you think? I it's almost like the singletons, right? So folks who are seeing are going into every new possible connection looking for the off-ramp, looking for the reason why this also is a no, because I think in in terms of the young folks and the younger folks who are who are who are still trying to look, right? Everybody's so disillusioned with the idea of it because we've seen it fail more than we've seen it succeed.

SPEAKER_11 21:16

What I used to see in divorce court all the time was, especially now that we have social media, is I don't want to be, I don't want to be made to look stupid. That's right. So if somebody's doing something, you go and do something too because you don't want to look stupid. My answer to that was if y'all don't put what's going on on social media, can't nobody look stupid and you can be in the in the house together and work things out.

SPEAKER_03 21:41

Can't look stupid if we can't see it. There you go.

SPEAKER_11 21:45

There you go. But everybody's worried about being made to look stupid, being made to look like the the unwanted one, and it's it's almost uh performative, you know what I mean? The way we date.

SPEAKER_03 21:58

It is not all. Almost it is performative. And when you return back to your tribe at the end of that relationship journey, you need to be able to save face. And so that and so you're managing that the whole time and you're never really present in the relationship and giving it everything you possibly could because you're worrying about how you're going to look in the event that this doesn't work.

SPEAKER_11 22:21

Or you're worried about how you're going to look if that guy isn't six foot and this, that, and the other thing, like you've settled for something when you might have the best thing in the world for you.

SPEAKER_03 22:34

Are they who's gonna are they gonna co-sign on that or not? Because 90% of the decisions we make are based on our friends, our family, and our co-workers and what we think they would think is cool. Think about that number. 90%. So if your girls aren't gonna co-sign on it, you can't really tell them about it.

SPEAKER_11 22:52

You can't. Absolutely. Absolutely. So on this one, the judgment call is I don't remember.

SPEAKER_03 23:00

I think I if we're gonna give her a wide birth, she said, do things for you or those things that help make your life easier. I can sign with her and judge and put and judge in her favor if that's what she truly meant.

SPEAKER_11 23:12

Yeah, if that's what she truly meant, but she did emphasize the money piece. She was worried about if you're worried about being a gold digger again, right? Worrying about what you look like. So I would have loved for her to elevate the more uh elevated parts of a relationship than than what she did.

SPEAKER_03 23:32

There is the, you know, the the good thing I like about it. Well, at best, I can hear a chorus in my head saying, hey ladies, who you are is enough to ask for stuff, right? And don't make yourself small thinking that you're not worth it. Exactly, exactly. So and the stuff doesn't have to be about money.

SPEAKER_11 23:52

No, it doesn't have to be about money. Does a judgment call is uh she she did okay. She did okay, she didn't okay. Just she reflected a lot of what concerns me and in and about what we uh value in a relationship.

SPEAKER_03 24:10

You got it, you got it. And and what a woman feels like she's got the right to show up and ask you.

SPEAKER_11 24:16

Ish, I got another one of your favorites.

The $50 Bag First Date Debate

SPEAKER_11 24:18

Am I the asshole? Am I the asshole?

SPEAKER_03 24:20

Here we go.

SPEAKER_11 24:21

Am I the asshole for expecting a guy to pay for me? Hi, this is my first time posting on Reddit here, so I'm sorry if this isn't written well or if I seem unsure. I just really need some outside opinions. I, 20-year-old female, recently broke up with my high school boyfriend after four years. This is one of my first dates as dating someone new, and I've already run into a situation I don't know how to feel about. I went on a date with this new guy. We met in the mall and went for coffee, which went smooth and we had a nice time. Then we wandered around the mall for a while. While walking through random stores and talking, I saw a bag I liked that cost about $50. I wasn't sure if I could buy it, if I should buy it because I'm in college and money is pretty tight for me. I could afford it, but you know, $50 is not nothing. When I hesitated, he reassured me, saying things like, Don't worry about the money and it's fine. Based on what he said, I low-key expected him to pay for it, especially since I wasn't planning to buy it in at first. But when we got to the cash register, he didn't say or do anything. Instead, he walked away and waited for me outside the register area when I paid for it myself. I felt a little confused and honestly mad. I thought his earlier comments meant he was offering to pay. So I paid and didn't want to seem greedy or make the situation awkward. So I didn't really say anything. I know you y'all will probably say, oh, you should have you should have stopped him or you should have confronted him. But I was just thrown off. And as I said, I was not about to argue with him or make it awkward. I know it's a common discussion on Reddit about whether women should expect guys to pay for things. So I'm kind of nervous about posting this. To be clear, I don't expect guys to pay for everything, and maybe I misread the situation, but at the at the same time, his words really made it seem as if he was going to. Can I start this one?

SPEAKER_03 26:17

By all means.

SPEAKER_11 26:18

I don't know what words she was listening to. The words that she repeated here had nothing to do with the fact that he was going to pay for it. She had just met this guy at the mall. They were walking around. She saw Bag D like. She said, Oh, go buy it, go buy it. It's just 50 bucks, go buy it. Why would she think that this random stranger that she just met was intimating that she he was going to pay for it? I don't understand that. If she said exactly what was on here, I just don't get it. I missed the point altogether.

SPEAKER_03 26:48

We don't even need to sidebar on that because it's not like you had dinner and got to know each other so you could actually have that back and forth. You met for a cheap, quick date, a coffee date at the mall. You can't expect him to be buying a bag for you, a purse on date one after coffee? That's unrealistic. That's just not that is not, she is not rooted in reality at this point.

SPEAKER_11 27:12

And I don't know where that comes from. Is that part of the in the zeitgeist these days that it is it it's part of what you should do and get? Wow.

SPEAKER_03 27:22

It is. I'm the prize. So what do I get? What's my gift? I showed up, I I did my nails, I did my hair, I did, I put on something super cute. This is what you get. What do I get for my effort? What do I get for my time and my effort tonight? And so it's a part of the zeitgeist, it's a part of that expectation. I don't think it's very realistic. You're in college, and yeah, $50 is a big deal. And it's a it's not a date date, it's a coffee date. Get out of here.

SPEAKER_11 27:50

They were wandering around the mall together.

SPEAKER_03 27:53

I mean, it just no, no, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_11 27:56

Yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't a rational expectation.

SPEAKER_03 28:00

It it will it was not. I can see her point, and a lot of women will also be like, Well, he said, go ahead and get it, but like you said, there were no words in that dialogue that said that intimated, and I will cover your expense. That's not what happened. Because again, he took you on a coffee date which says he's trying not to have a big spend.

SPEAKER_11 28:20

And the relationship just doesn't support that that kind of ask, you know what I mean? It didn't support it. It didn't six months in a row, that's a different story, but not now. Right.

SPEAKER_03 28:34

So but not now.

SPEAKER_11 28:35

You're not an asshole for expecting him to pay for it, but you were being unrealistic.

SPEAKER_03 28:41

Way off base. That's my judgment call. Yeah, way off base, way off base. No.

SPEAKER_11 28:47

Madison, what's next?

SPEAKER_08 28:49

Judgment call. If

Who Pays For Hair And Nails

SPEAKER_08 28:52

we were dating, would I need to pay for your hair and your nails?

SPEAKER_06 28:56

Honestly, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 28:59

What gives you that mentality?

SPEAKER_06 29:01

Um, I mean, like if you want me to look good, then you gotta pay for it.

SPEAKER_08 29:05

But if you were doing it before I came into your life, why do I have to start doing that now that I'm your man?

SPEAKER_06 29:10

Um, I would say because you would want me to look good, so you would want me to do those things.

SPEAKER_08 29:14

So how much do your nails cost?

SPEAKER_06 29:17

Um probably anywhere between 60 to 80. Like every three weeks.

SPEAKER_08 29:23

And hair?

SPEAKER_06 29:25

Depending on the hair, sometimes $90, sometimes a thousand.

SPEAKER_08 29:29

A thousand dollars? And I would have to put that as your man?

SPEAKER_06 29:34

I mean, if you're not gonna pay for it all, maybe like at least half.

SPEAKER_08 29:37

At least half. Why would it cost a thousand dollars to get your hair done?

SPEAKER_06 29:43

Um, if you get like extensions, if you get treatments put in your hair, like I don't know. I like to have nice hair, so.

SPEAKER_08 29:50

Is there ever a time where you would pay for your man's haircut or no?

SPEAKER_06 29:56

No. No, I'm not paying for his haircut. And that's because that's a man's job. Is that a man's job-ish?

SPEAKER_03 30:09

Imagine you here, man. Um, listen. First of all, first of all, I might need to move where where they're living because here in South Florida, in Miami, males are 200, and here is 2,000 off the rip if you're getting extensions. So I might need to move to a much smaller, more uh realistic dating atmosphere. Um, listen, Judge, that is now the expectation. Okay? I'm I'm stunned. That is that is the expectation. Call it a perk, call it a feature of the dating program. But that is the expectation. If you're with a guy and he's not able to do these things, and again, because now after he does these things, I get to go back to my girls and present what the YouTubers and my dear friend Liz, who's a master YouTuber, Hurricane Liz, calls social proof that I've got something worthwhile here. He did the nails, he did the hair, and I'm here looking good, and I didn't have to pay for it. That is social proof that helps me know that I've got somebody good. Because unless I get that social proof, I don't know if what I did was cool. I posted the pick, Judge, and only got 40 likes. Maybe it wasn't as cool as I thought.

SPEAKER_11 31:25

Where do you think that takes us, Ish? I mean, when you play the tape to the end, as you used to say, as you always say, what what's playing at the end of that tape?

SPEAKER_03 31:38

Right. Well, we're not fulfilled uh because we have no idea if what we just experienced was fulfilling or not, because it is all based on external validations. Did people like it? Did people say it was cool? Did all my girlfriends co-sign on it? Did all my guys think I was cool and being manly because I did it, right? Uh and so that it takes us to a place of being alone, unfulfilled, and really lonely.

SPEAKER_11 32:05

Yeah. I just and it and and I think it also limits those people who can date to a very small, small everybody's going after the same two people.

SPEAKER_03 32:19

Very, very small.

SPEAKER_11 32:20

So the bottom only not considering all of the other measures and the and and of of of what's what it's valuable.

SPEAKER_03 32:29

When you look at the numbers, 80% of the women are going after 10% of the guys. As the kids say, that math ain't math, and that math doesn't work, right? That math doesn't work. And so it it makes it a very icky, it makes the dating pool a very icky place to swim. And we've got to use all these metrics to make it worthwhile. And even if I meet somebody who's really cool, right? Here's a scenario. I met somebody, they're really cool. They're absolutely adorable. I think they're the prettiest thing I've ever seen, the most handsome thing I've ever seen. And they make me laugh, they make me smile, they support me, they're all this thing, don't make a whole lot of money. We split most of the bills every time we go out, and I they can't afford extra money for the hair or the nails and all those things. Is that still a good deal for you?

SPEAKER_11 33:19

And that's a right now thing, too. You know what I mean? People grow into just like I always talk about this. My father had no money when he married my mother, but he said, You stick with me and I will get some. And demanding it all up front keeps you from getting those guys and women out there who are on a trajectory. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 33:42

That's right. Now, among the guys who kind of have some level of uh self-possession and kind of know where they're headed in life and may not quite be all the way there yet. And nobody's ever all the way there, you know what I mean? But among those guys, the talk is hey, I'm looking for somebody who wants to make me be a better man. So I can get out there and try a little bit harder and take some risks and do some things. I want that person who can see, hey, I may not be a total diamond in the rough, but I'm still a work in progress. And I let that kind of push me and propel me. But that's a hard thing to find these days because we want it ready-made. We want it instantly, right? So we can post it tonight.

SPEAKER_11 34:25

It's so distressing and depressing.

SPEAKER_03 34:29

It is, it is, it is, and so look, but but the numbers back it up, right? The the younger generation, they're not getting married.

SPEAKER_11 34:39

No, they're not. No, they're not. They're not. No, they're not. Even over the years on divorce court, we had to expand the cases we saw because fewer and fewer people all the time over the decades were not getting married. They're not getting married.

SPEAKER_03 34:53

They're just not. Right? There's such a thing as a cohabitation agreement because we're gonna live together and we're gonna see how this goes. Right. But we're not gonna make that formal commitment. So many of the younger generation have seen older folks, they've seen their parents not do it very well. The divorce rate's damn near 60%. And of the 40 who are together, we know half of those folks are absolutely yeah, aren't happy anyway.

SPEAKER_11 35:16

Wow. But we're working on the wrong end of the equation.

SPEAKER_03 35:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_11 35:21

We're working on the beginning of the equation. We're making all of our decisions on that immediate thing, and we should be working on the other end of the equation.

SPEAKER_03 35:30

That's right. And we're and we're doing it because we're not we're we're talking about folks who are not pouring from a full cup, right? If you've got um yeah, when you talk about the gold digger and 50-50, well, most of the guys I know who worried about gold diggers are guys who ain't got no gold, right? You know what I mean? They don't, right? Because the guys and the people I know who've got gold, they are looking for every excuse to get rid of some. What can I what can I give you? What can I do for you? Right? What can I do to add some value to this experience, this earth thing that we're doing? And what, but when you're pouring from a full cup, Judge, you don't worry about giving too much and not getting it back. You just give because it makes you happy to do so. And my goodness, I hope they appreciate it. I can't, right? Whatever their experience of it is, is their experience of it, but I hope they appreciate it. But it sure did make me feel good by giving because you're and if you can find somebody else who's pouring from that same kind of cup, oh, now as my daddy would say, now you're cooking with gas, boy. Okay. But um, you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_11 36:30

Yeah. I just I guess it's not a a matter of getting back to where we were, but it's a matter of dealing with this technology in a way that has in insinuated itself into our lives in a manner that has made us behave differently. And we need to be less attached to that and more concentrating on the individual.

SPEAKER_03 36:55

Yeah, yeah. Um yeah, focus more on it on experiences and not expenses, and that'll help you, you know, average average phone time, seven to nine hours per day for our young folks.

unknown 37:09

Really?

SPEAKER_03 37:10

Seven, I believe. Nine hours per day. Everything happens here, and if it's not real and validated here, then it has no value. Then it has no value. Yeah, it's got no value, it's got no value, right? And so we're getting this warp, we're getting this warped sense of reality about what has meaning, what doesn't, what's cool, what's not, even even what's pretty and what's not, right? Is what we're seeing real? Because when I I saw the person I saw on the dating app, sure as shit doesn't look like the person who I showed up and had a coffee with. So I don't know what's real and what's not.

SPEAKER_11 37:41

And I remembered ish when I'm not gonna talk about the year, but on marriage boot camp, we were sitting there watching and we couldn't tell the women apart because they all had on a uniform.

SPEAKER_03 37:53

Yes. Remember this? I remember that season. I remember that season.

SPEAKER_11 37:57

You're supposed to have this much hair, you're supposed to have this color on, and we we couldn't tell them apart for a while because there's such strict rules for how you have to show up in this world.

SPEAKER_03 38:10

That's right. The algo does not allow for deviation. Do it this way and nothing else.

SPEAKER_11 38:16

There you go. So the judgment call on this one was woo! That's all I got.

SPEAKER_03 38:27

Woof!

SPEAKER_02 38:27

Woof!

Social Media Proof And Loneliness

SPEAKER_03 38:28

Yeah, yeah. We're in we're in we're in trouble, man, because we're looking, we're we're looking so far, everybody's looking for that that place to go to feel good. And you can't look inwardly to do it. And this is the thing that's sustainable. This is the thing that's gonna naturally replenish itself over and over and over every single night, but we're being taught something different every single day because we're all looking in the wrong direction, and we're just feeling less connected, less, less full, more empty, and it and it's making us miserable. And we don't know, we don't know who's got the off button so they can stop the ride and let me off.

SPEAKER_11 39:07

Yeah. Absolutely. Well, we should think about what we ought to do about that. I don't know. It's maybe mighty be a matter of realization, what people are understanding and and how people are looking at what they're looking at.

SPEAKER_03 39:23

You know what I mean? I do know what you mean. Focus on experience, not expense. I told this kid, I told a 13-year-old in in my practice today, I was like, listen, man, I was like, hey kid, uh, it's the summertime. You should get outside more. And you know he looked at me and said, Judge, what? What am I gonna do outside? It was like, what's what's out there?

SPEAKER_11 39:51

Get back at at nightfall.

SPEAKER_03 39:54

Right, it's right, right. Uh, we wouldn't dare step foot in that kitchen in that house before the crickets or the cicadas started chirping and the street lights there, not happening. And so it's it's a different thing. So we've got to figure out a way to make that online because we're not giving up our devices. We're not we gotta figure out a way to make that online experience a little more fulfilling and a little more reality-based, you know, still for entertainment and all the fun, but also you can get some good stuff there too. And hopefully, hopefully, um, I know, you know what? I know there's a podcast out there called Judgment Call, and it's it's a good place to go to get some reality-based information. I would start listening and watching that. That's what I would do.

SPEAKER_11 40:36

I think that's an excellent idea, an outstanding idea. So today, what we were talking about was that 50-50 thing, and it really gave me pause. Yeah, you know, to do what I do as a in divorce court judge, seeing people leave each other all the time, and now to see that we can't get together anymore.

SPEAKER_02 40:58

Right.

SPEAKER_11 40:59

Uh, you know, wow.

SPEAKER_03 41:01

Well, Judge, let me ask you this now before before I let you go. So,

Trad Wife Choices And Real Risk

SPEAKER_03 41:05

what's your call on this whole institution of um and the growing movement of moving back towards a trad wife, a traditional wife? I'm gonna stay at home, I'm gonna take care of the kids, I'm gonna manage the home, and you're gonna go out there and slug out another world. And that's a that's been a growing thing now for the last five, six years, trad wife, trad wife, trad wife.

SPEAKER_11 41:26

I I've heard about that. As long as that's what you want to do. That's that's the thing. It is it's it's it's okay to do whatever you want to do. My my my mother was a trad wife. I am, and my mother raised me not to be one. She raised me to be a lawyer and my my my sister a doctor, and and to do that thing. So as long as it's your decision, and your decision based on information, understanding about not only yourself, but the institution of marriage and the person with whom you're married. That's that's what you gotta do. It's it's it's not simple. I'm gonna be a trad wife. Okay, what are the rules? Let me do this. Right. It doesn't work out.

SPEAKER_03 42:10

Do you worry about what you have to give up in terms of yes, that level of independence, of earning your own way and what kind of sacrifices and things you're gonna have to swallow because you're feeling like you're not showing up in that way. I work what I see on the other side of it is women who get stuck. And the relationship takes a turn, a darker turn, and they don't have a way out because they were doing the trad wife thing, right? So they were not required to have an income. They were focused on the family, and that was the way it got set up. But when things went south in the relationship, they didn't have the resources to keep themselves and their kids safe. So that's the part that worries me about it.

SPEAKER_11 42:55

Yeah, I mean, and and that'd be a difficult thing. Divorce laws are uh are in place to to to help with that as much as they can with the alimony and all this kind of stuff, but spousal support, but that that breaks both ways, right? And uh I don't know. I mean, it's just uh I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 43:14

I don't have any problem with the movement as long as everybody's in the river uh intentionally, as long as everybody knows why they're there and we agree to play by the same hands and are comfortable where being there. You got it, you got it. Yep, yep. And we agree not to say to move the goalposts.

SPEAKER_11 43:32

Right.

SPEAKER_03 43:33

All right, 50. All right, 50 50.

SPEAKER_11 43:36

Okay, we're clear.

Final Thoughts And Sign Off

SPEAKER_04 43:38

She's seen it all from the bench. He's helped couples through it all. Now they're making the call on the internet's biggest relationship debates real relationships, real reactions, real talk. This is Judgment Call.